How to determine if device is really dead

Discussions about Z-Way software and Z-Wave technology in general
lanbrown
Posts: 279
Joined: 01 Jun 2021 08:06

Re: How to determine if device is really dead

Post by lanbrown »

It doesn't matter what if the command class for a firmware update is there or not. Qubino does not make their firmware available to download. So even if that command class was there, it doesn't matter since the firmware itself is not available.

Aeotec requires Windows with since they only offer a standalone software update client.
Zooz allows firmware updates, but you have to request access to download the firmware. They just don't make it readily available.
Qubino doesn't allow you to update the firmware.
Inovelli provides stable and beta firmware
Jasco doesn't provide firmware updates
Enerwave doesn't provide firmware updates
seattleneil
Posts: 172
Joined: 02 Mar 2020 22:41

Re: How to determine if device is really dead

Post by seattleneil »

This thread has morphed...

Understood and agree that different companies make their own business decisions. The lack of meaningful accountability by the Z-Wave Alliance for bad actors is appalling. Z-Wave.me, Aeotec and Zooz should be applauded and supported for being good actors. Although Aeotec requires their Windows app to perform an OTA (which is a hassle), I suspect they're simply trying to ensure a robust OTA process. As for Zooz, their requirement to know what product you're trying to update seems reasonable (and is only a small hassle). Customer support and ongoing product support costs money that Jasco and Enerwave don't want to pay.

To my knowledge, Z-Wave lacks an end-to-end firmware update process where a controller is able to determine if there are devices with outdated firmware and then give the user the ability to upgrade the device's firmware "auto-magically". This seems to be a failure shared by the Z-Wave Alliance and Z-Wave device vendors. I have other home automation devices (including Wi-Fi thermostats, smart clocks, smart light bulbs, mobile phones, Apple products) that ship with bootstrap firmware and auto-magically upgrade themselves when they are first installed and can update themselves after installation. There is a sad irony that Z-Way's diagnostic tools shed light on vendor bugs. So instead of being in the dark and frustrated about why something isn't working, we get to see the problem and are only frustrated.

I can't predict the future, but I think it's worth remembering Z-Wave is a 20-year old technology that continues to evolve. I'm optimistic the Silicon Labs Z-Wave 700-series modules (using Long Range) will solve mesh-complexity issues, but that won't help with legacy Z-Wave products. In the meantime, I plan to stick with good Z-Wave actors such as Z-Wave.me, Aeotec and Zooz.

Returning to your mis-behaving Qubino. What happens if you do an insecure inclusion on a factory-reset device and no temperature sensor (i.e., just basic functionality)? If the device appears to be reliable with basic functionality, it seems reasonable to assume there's a problem with some of the advanced features.
lanbrown
Posts: 279
Joined: 01 Jun 2021 08:06

Re: How to determine if device is really dead

Post by lanbrown »

Both devices were at factory defaults when I got them and they had issues. I really don't need your assistance. I was merely telling the other person that has had issues with their Qubino that I have had the same issues. The device works better with security off. It is clear that Qubino has issues and will continue to do so.

Z-Wave being 20 years old that continues to evolve is not worth remembering. Ethernet is over 40 years old. 802.11 (WLAN) is over 20 years old. They also continue to evolve.
bogr
Posts: 190
Joined: 16 Nov 2015 22:46

Re: How to determine if device is really dead

Post by bogr »

Just for future reference, another exclude and include suddenly made the device work. Thanks for all feedback.
lanbrown
Posts: 279
Joined: 01 Jun 2021 08:06

Re: How to determine if device is really dead

Post by lanbrown »

Be sure to look at the parameters and make sure no settings are too aggressive in terms of reporting or have Z-Way poll the device too often. I have found this helps trigger the node is failed. Chances are that Z-Way sees an issue in communicating with the device over a number of tries, then it is declaring the node as failed. So aggressive communication expedites that to happen.

Did you use secure or unsecure? I've had nothing but issues with secure on both Qubino devices that I have. They can be added but eventually they stop communicating which then requires an exclude and include to get them working again. I still think the range on them are subpar but the Gen 7 Razberry Pro does help with the better antenna.
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